Ukrainian MP: Russia has abducted nearly 200,000 children during forced deportations

Anna Dohnalová Anna Dohnalová
10. 5. 2022 14:14
Russia sends opponents of its aggression in Ukraine to isolation prisons and torture chambers, says Ukrainian MP Lesia Vasylenko in an interview for Aktuálně.cz. She describes what is known as the filtration camps. Ukrainians go through them during forced deportations to Russia. Among them are children, whom soldiers have already transferred nearly 200,000 to be "re-educated" across the border.
Ukrainian MP Lesia Vasylenko
Ukrainian MP Lesia Vasylenko | Foto: Twitter: Lesia Vasylenko

Recently, you tweeted a picture by an 11-year-old boy representing how he sees the world after being raped by a Russian soldier in front of his mother. How often do you read reports like this?

Basically every day we hear new stories of rape being used as a weapon of war. They are collected by the office of the Ombudsman Lyudmyla Denisova and then, of course, by the Prosecutor General's Office.

Does this mean not only little girls but also little boys are being raped by Russian soldiers? 

Yes. Russian soldiers sexually attack both women and men, as well as little boys and girls, and even toddlers and infants.

At the beginning of April you tweeted that 5000 war crimes have been committed and recorded by the General Prosecutor’s Office. What are the statistics now, a month later? 

As of May 1, my team, which is constantly updating the numbers, registered 9,158 war crimes. That is nearly double the number within a month.

And what war crimes specifically fall under this number?

We are talking about rape, child abduction, torture, hostage taking, filtration camps, forced removal of Ukrainians and their transfer into Russia, Ukrainian civilians being forced into Russian army and to fight against their own country, deliberate mass murder of civilians, and genocide, the crime of crimes. 

To give you a better idea, we know, for example, that soldiers are ordered to rape women until they can no longer have Ukrainian children. That is the reality we now live in Ukraine.

The CEO of La Strada Ukraine Kateryna Cherepakha has told me in an interview that some cases are not even discovered as soldiers often kill their victims after the rape. Do you have any record of that? 

Unfortunately, yes. Many bodies of not only women but also men with signs of rape were found in populated areas. Because these people were killed by Russian soldiers, they can never speak again and will never receive any justice. They are the silent victims and we must not forget them.

Would you say the actual number of victims is much higher?

Absolutely. But it is very difficult to tell you the exact number. The UN figures used by most international media are much lower than official data of the Ukrainian government. For us Ukrainians, it is a mystery, we do not understand why the UN is diminishing the extent of damage and human suffering.

Do you know in which occupied places this happens the most? We all have heard about Bucha, but isn’t that only a very limited picture of what’s really happening?

It is happening everywhere. Everyday more and more victims are uncovered. The Ukrainian government already has a system in place and is conducting mass investigations into them.

At the end of March, you tweeted that 2000 kids had been kidnapped by Russia. Do you have any new numbers? And what about the victims of sexual assaults?

Almost two hundred thousand Ukrainian children - specifically 196,356 - were illegally transferred to Russia. 

The number of rape victims is difficult to establish. The official data held by the authorities estimate around 400 victims of sexual violence. However, these are only the cases recorded by the official telephone line of the Ombudsman. There are also many other non-governmental organizations in Ukraine that help these women. As a result, the number will be much higher.

Do you know what happens with the abducted children? 

Similar to what happens to all the people who are kidnapped by Russian soldiers. It is not just children. Russia is offering people trapped in towns that are under attack, like Mariupol, that they will take them to safety. But because Ukrainians refuse this, they have developed different tactics. When people try to evacuate themselves by car, for example, they have to pass about 20 different checkpoints. At these checkpoints the traffic is often diverted into Russia and Russians are accompanying the fleeing Ukrainians across the border to Russia with guns pointed at them. 

What happens after they get to Russia?

Russians place them in filtration camps, as it used to happen during World War II under Hitler or Stalin. Special forces from the Russian authorities then search their personal belongings, look for tattoos, search their phones and try to find signs of war resistance.

And if they find it?

If they find that the person or their family has served in the Ukrainian army since 2014, then they will take them to isolation prisons, torture chambers or simply make them dissapear. Many Ukrainians have gone missing like that. The rest of the people are promised to be taken care of, but instead, Russia takes them to Siberia. Yes, forced deportation is really happening in the 21st century.

As a mother of three children and a woman, how do you cope with this?

I can't help but imagine what if it was me, my family, my children. It paralyzes me, but it also drives me forward, forces me to do more and makes me fight to ensure that these war crimes no longer occur and that the perpetrators are punished.

On the other hand, I still cannot understand that this is happening and that it is happening in the 21st century, in the middle of civilized Europe, and that people are voluntarily and cruelly hurting other people in this way.

When I think about the terrible crimes that the Russians have committed against people, I feel a huge sense of helplessness. There is no prevention. People are trapped, most of the time they can't go to the authorities, they have to deal with it themselves. This is the worst thing for me as a representative of the people and a mother of three, that such horrors are happening, but you do not have the means to stop them.

What is the role of Parliament in this crisis and also yours as a member of Parliament? 

My role is largely to make sure that these cases are talked about, that they are known, not just inside Ukraine but beyond its borders, in the international community. From Poland, Czech Republic, to the United Kingdom, the United States and beyond. By drawing attention to these events, we, as Members of Parliament, are calling on the countries to take strong action against the Russian aggression and to put an end to it as soon as possible.

At the end of March, you and a couple of other Parliament members, went on a diplomatic mission around Europe to talk with foreign ministers and governments to ensure support for Ukraine. Would you consider the mission successful?

The support is a work in progress, it has risen significantly. At the beginning, they told us that we would never have enough weapons, that we could never defeat Russia. But Ukraine still stands. 

However, some countries are still not very clear on where they stand. There is still hope among political and spiritual leaders that compromise can be reached but unfortunately it cannot. The world must realize that the crime of aggression does not stop by itself. There has not been a single case in history where the crime of aggression has been stopped by diplomatic talks.

Unfortunately, aggression means that one country, in this case Russia, uses all its physical force and oppressive mechanisms to destroy another nation. And the only way to stop this is to push back with physical force. 

Are you saying that armies of the surrounding countries should step in and go help Ukraine?

At this point, things have changed dramatically because Ukraine is getting a lot of sophisticated weapons from all over the world. If this continues at the same level as it is happening right now, I am pretty sure that Ukraine can stand. However, it would help us a lot. I am not saying that the whole of NATO should be mobilized and intervene, but we would appreciate it if at least some countries decided to do so. NATO is an alliance in which states have the right to decide for themselves.

At least if Russia declares an all out war, Ukraine will call not only for more weapons, but also for help from countries that are better equipped militarily than ours.

And what about the threat of nuclear weapons? Are you scared Russia might use them?

Fear has become a very relative concept in Ukraine in the past couple of weeks. I would lie if I said we weren't afraid. However, it is not the fear of death, but the fear of having to live in occupation, the fear of our rights being taken away and a fear for our own existence.

This fear is utterly numbing, but at the same time it acts as a driving force forward. So, if you ask me if we are afraid of a nuclear attack in Ukraine, I will tell you at this point that we are ready for everything.

 

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